Spoiler Thread

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  • edited November 2015
    well linley could also just ask the overgods to kill the four chief sovereigns related to his elements and give their sparks to him


    Edit: but beirut and bluefire was to focused on the sovereign weapons to try and test this possibility because they in the heat of the moment forgot linley was a four way soul-mutated and thought it will be better for him to get an overgod weapon, since beirut still had 2 sovereign sparks left. and did not even consider if it was possible to get the chief sovereign spark. after all even if the overgod of life refused they could just ask for the weapon after that, you know the same principle like since i can not grant this request you will need to make another one(like when linley ask for granpa Dohring and was told it was not possible).
  • TenFap said:


    TenFap said:




    I'm not to sure that the overgod weapon of life was just created without thought (coming into existence) because the 
    writer explains the look on the overgod face as almost loving. I think it's possible that the weapon has existed years and the overgod is attached to it.
    I know that it's written that the overgods are just basicly the laws of the universe but if that was so then why did the writer write it that way. 
    Also if the overgods are only there to keep things running and have no other motives then why did the overgod of life send out the mission to collect the three parts of the crown
    This wouldn't have any effect on the next creator of the next universe because it was set up that a soul mutate of the four basic elements would be the next one
    First of all, it's been stated many times that the Overgods are program-like existences that do not have emotions or have empathy. The reason why the Overgod of Life had that "expression" is because it personifies the image of an Overgod of Life. If it was the Overgod of Death then I would bet that the facial expression would be grim, deathlike, and cold. Just what you would expect from Death. Besides, the Overgods don't actually have a body/image/personification to begin with. They are just there to monitor the universe.

    The Overgod of Life isn't the only Overgod to send out a mission. All the Overgods do, but they take turns. That's why the Chief Sov of Destruction has a Destruction Overgod weapon instead of a Life Overgod weapon. Although, whoever wins the Overgod mission could very well ask for their own specific type of weapon. However, I doubt an Overgod of Life could create a weapon with Destruction energy. It just doesn't work. Also, it has never been stated as to why the Overgods send out missions (from what I know). I would have to guess that Hong Meng inserted that type of command into their "programs". Why? I dunno, maybe because he wanted to? Who knows.

    Also that last statement of your's doesn't really relate to the Overgods. Sure, Linley got a Life Overgod weapon, but what does that have to do with him becoming a UC? It does help Linley gain an advantage over other Sov. and catch up with the other Sov. that have Overgod items, but Linley could've made it to UC even without the Overgod weapon. He could've just found a Fire Sov., killed him, absorbed the spark, then bam UC-level power.




    The reason i mention the overgods and the weapon is because of the fact the overgods only do things that their maker (Hong) programmed them to do. With this in mind, why would the overgods make overgod items when it's doest help the next potential universe creator and if it doesn't help the universe or the next UC then why do it at all.

    If the overgod items were to help the next universe creator become a UC then i could understand why the overgods interfere and make overgod items but it doesn't, and so they shouldn't do it if they are just programs 

    On some of the last chapters (spoilers) its explained that you need to be a soul mutate of four basic elements (fire, water, earth and wind) to be come a UC. There is other things but a overgod item isn't needed.

    With all this in mind i suggest that the overgod weapons have no factor on the universe or (Hong) and was made just to be used at the whim of the overgods (despite having no emotions) This might suggest that they do in fact have drives and goals despite being told that they do not.

    Don't forget at one point in time, this story said the saint was the highest level then moved on all the way to high god and the sov

    P.S what i've just written isn't fact, but then again it's not hard to take the leap with the evidence that was written

    I would say that what i wrote is speculation but then again saying the overgod of life having a loving face due to it being a manifestation of life is also a speculation. What Sitrix wrote made sense but it wasn't in the story or explained

    So this is why i mentioned the overgod weapons and why i think the overgods do have emotions 

    I'm probably wrong, after all it was wrote that the overgods were emotionless but i think that a sov said this 
  • Now that i think about it, if the overgods are only programs and have no defined shapes, why did the overgod of life turn up as a women with a gentle smile. If they have no self then why not a cube of grey mush. It feels like they do in fact have a defined shape and maybe some ego to go with it.
     
  • TenFap said:

    Now that i think about it, if the overgods are only programs and have no defined shapes, why did the overgod of life turn up as a women with a gentle smile. If they have no self then why not a cube of grey mush. It feels like they do in fact have a defined shape and maybe some ego to go with it.

     
    On the last chapter Linley is told the Overgods are emotionless energy beings created to maintain the laws without outside guidance. Their faces are nothing more then pictures they were given by Hong Meng.
  • TenFap said:

    Now that i think about it, if the overgods are only programs and have no defined shapes, why did the overgod of life turn up as a women with a gentle smile. If they have no self then why not a cube of grey mush. It feels like they do in fact have a defined shape and maybe some ego to go with it.

     
     Also, naturally, if you design an AI or Automated Programs(Programs that acts based on the actions of the user), which the Overgods could easily be classified as, you would naturally give it a type of personality and startup behaviour.

    So, when the Overgod appears, it would have that gentle smile because it was programmed to act in such a manner upon appearing. Programmer who loves theories regarding AI and AP talking here. XD
  • Which side of Planar War will win in upcoming War?!
    And who will play major role in it?!

    The best way is to hire Paragons for that, but it is really hard to find reasonable payment for them!

    Question: Can Linley find 2 emmisianaries and give them 3 artifact each?!
    He has 3 Sovereign clones, so each clone gives 1 artifact resulting only 2 emmisianaries but with full set of artifacts!
    Is it against rules or not?!
    Because in 1 of spoilers i heard that Sovereign gifted 3 artifact 3 different people but they (2 of them) gave their artifact to third, resulting 1 having 3 artifacts!
  • I think you misunderstand the rule, it's not 1 sovereign artifact per sovereign spark, it's 1 artifact per emissary, doesn't matter how many sparks the sovereign has.
  • I think you misunderstand the rule, it's not 1 sovereign artifact per sovereign spark, it's 1 artifact per emissary, doesn't matter how many sparks the sovereign has.

    But some have artifacts from Sovereigns, but not emissary!
    For example childs of Sovereign! Sovereign can gift anyone a artifact without asking anything in return, but only one artifact!
  • @tenfap,

    you're confused about something. the overgods are not programmed with the purpose of creating or helping a universe creator. the overgods primary purpose is to maintain the CD universe. there are a few side programs they have such as overgod missions, eliminating destructive elements (aka killing sovereigns that destroy material plans), rewarding the victors of 10 straight planar wars, and probably a few other things.

    none of that has anything to do with universe creators. the reason overgod items have nothing to do with UC's is because UC's aren't a factor. they are literally, a one in infinity existence, that is so rare that nobody even prepares for them till they appear.
  • Vexram said:

    @tenfap,

    you're confused about something. the overgods are not programmed with the purpose of creating or helping a universe creator. the overgods primary purpose is to maintain the CD universe. there are a few side programs they have such as overgod missions, eliminating destructive elements (aka killing sovereigns that destroy material plans), rewarding the victors of 10 straight planar wars, and probably a few other things.

    none of that has anything to do with universe creators. the reason overgod items have nothing to do with UC's is because UC's aren't a factor. they are literally, a one in infinity existence, that is so rare that nobody even prepares for them till they appear.

    Then what point does the overgod items have. They don't help the universe, and according to what you wrote the overgods only do things that protects the laws of the universe.

    Overgod items don't protect the universe and with the sov wanting their power and killing each other to gain them, it's clear that the overgod items hurt the universe by making the sov's greedy and kill for them.

    If overgod items don't help the universe or UC then the overgods are doing things out of their program 
  • TenFap said:

    Vexram said:

    @tenfap,

    you're confused about something. the overgods are not programmed with the purpose of creating or helping a universe creator. the overgods primary purpose is to maintain the CD universe. there are a few side programs they have such as overgod missions, eliminating destructive elements (aka killing sovereigns that destroy material plans), rewarding the victors of 10 straight planar wars, and probably a few other things.

    none of that has anything to do with universe creators. the reason overgod items have nothing to do with UC's is because UC's aren't a factor. they are literally, a one in infinity existence, that is so rare that nobody even prepares for them till they appear.

    Then what point does the overgod items have. They don't help the universe, and according to what you wrote the overgods only do things that protects the laws of the universe.

    Overgod items don't protect the universe and with the sov wanting their power and killing each other to gain them, it's clear that the overgod items hurt the universe by making the sov's greedy and kill for them.

    If overgod items don't help the universe or UC then the overgods are doing things out of their program 



    So far, the only way to get an overgod artifact is to complete an overgod mission, so it would certainly make sense that these are part of the overgod mission programming (complete your mission and then u can ask overgod to tailor made an artifact for you) .


    Since overgod artifact can only be properly used by sovereigns, it's probably part of UC's original program to keep sovereigns motivated to get stronger. (and possibly become another UC,..remember Hong Meng complaining about being lonely...)
  • TenFap said:

    Vexram said:

    @tenfap,

    you're confused about something. the overgods are not programmed with the purpose of creating or helping a universe creator. the overgods primary purpose is to maintain the CD universe. there are a few side programs they have such as overgod missions, eliminating destructive elements (aka killing sovereigns that destroy material plans), rewarding the victors of 10 straight planar wars, and probably a few other things.

    none of that has anything to do with universe creators. the reason overgod items have nothing to do with UC's is because UC's aren't a factor. they are literally, a one in infinity existence, that is so rare that nobody even prepares for them till they appear.

    Then what point does the overgod items have. They don't help the universe, and according to what you wrote the overgods only do things that protects the laws of the universe.

    Overgod items don't protect the universe and with the sov wanting their power and killing each other to gain them, it's clear that the overgod items hurt the universe by making the sov's greedy and kill for them.

    If overgod items don't help the universe or UC then the overgods are doing things out of their program 
    you really can't understand? really?

    let me ask you this, what's the purpose of the planar wars? according to your logic, planar wars serve no purpose either and hurt the universe.

    fact is. both are helpful to the universe. the planar wars helps to control the population,  and the overgod missions help to control the sovereigns. think of how many sovereigns might die in a fight for the overgod talismans? each dead sovereign is a chance for a new sovereign to take his place. as for overgod items, well those are prizes for winning a game of life and death. both the planar wars and overgod missions promote progress.

    anyways, if you really need a reason for overgod missions, then just take it as hong meng adding it in to curve his bordom.
  • Sitrix said:

    Sitrix said:

    TenFap said:


    TenFap said:

    Vexram said:

    @tenfap,

    you're confused about something. the overgods are not programmed with the purpose of creating or helping a universe creator. the overgods primary purpose is to maintain the CD universe. there are a few side programs they have such as overgod missions, eliminating destructive elements (aka killing sovereigns that destroy material plans), rewarding the victors of 10 straight planar wars, and probably a few other things.

    none of that has anything to do with universe creators. the reason overgod items have nothing to do with UC's is because UC's aren't a factor. they are literally, a one in infinity existence, that is so rare that nobody even prepares for them till they appear.

    Then what point does the overgod items have. They don't help the universe, and according to what you wrote the overgods only do things that protects the laws of the universe.

    Overgod items don't protect the universe and with the sov wanting their power and killing each other to gain them, it's clear that the overgod items hurt the universe by making the sov's greedy and kill for them.

    If overgod items don't help the universe or UC then the overgods are doing things out of their program 
    If you think you'll get a logical explanation for everything in CD, then you're wrong. There are may things that IET left out, mostly characters, but he also left out explanations for certain things. For example, why the Overgods specifically issue Overgod missions. And, like Vexram stated, the Overgod missions are similar to the Planar Wars. Both are brought about by the Overgods, and I'm not even going to go into that because Vexram already did.

    It is actually stated in the CD book that the Overgods are program-like existences. The Overgod of Life's appearance was merely a personification of what an Overgod of Life may look like, to which Hong Meng most likely programmed in to it. The Overgods don't actually have an appearance, because they are programs. Only the creator of such programs can create their appearance. 

    I don't know what else to type. There's clear evidence throughout the spoiler forum as well as the several comments me and Vexram have posted. 
  • edited November 2015
    Sitrix said:

    Sitrix said:

    TenFap said:


    TenFap said:

    Vexram said:

    @tenfap,

    you're confused about something. the overgods are not programmed with the purpose of creating or helping a universe creator. the overgods primary purpose is to maintain the CD universe. there are a few side programs they have such as overgod missions, eliminating destructive elements (aka killing sovereigns that destroy material plans), rewarding the victors of 10 straight planar wars, and probably a few other things.

    none of that has anything to do with universe creators. the reason overgod items have nothing to do with UC's is because UC's aren't a factor. they are literally, a one in infinity existence, that is so rare that nobody even prepares for them till they appear.

    Then what point does the overgod items have. They don't help the universe, and according to what you wrote the overgods only do things that protects the laws of the universe.

    Overgod items don't protect the universe and with the sov wanting their power and killing each other to gain them, it's clear that the overgod items hurt the universe by making the sov's greedy and kill for them.

    If overgod items don't help the universe or UC then the overgods are doing things out of their program 
    If you think you'll get a logical explanation for everything in CD, then you're wrong. There are may things that IET left out, mostly characters, but he also left out explanations for certain things. For example, why the Overgods specifically issue Overgod missions. And, like Vexram stated, the Overgod missions are similar to the Planar Wars. Both are brought about by the Overgods, and I'm not even going to go into that because Vexram already did.

    It is actually stated in the CD book that the Overgods are program-like existences. The Overgod of Life's appearance was merely a personification of what an Overgod of Life may look like, to which Hong Meng most likely programmed in to it. The Overgods don't actually have an appearance, because they are programs. Only the creator of such programs can create their appearance. 

    I don't know what else to type. There's clear evidence throughout the spoiler forum as well as the several comments me and Vexram have posted. 


    I can understand the programmed state of the overgods and the way they look. Your explanation makes sense and was detailed but what I'm saying is that overgod items are flawed (if not the overgod items, then the overgods them selfs).

    Unlike the planar wars the overgod items are flawed unless your saying that the overgod items main function is that they are there for change.

    It been said that the planar war is there to thin the ranks of the highgods and the winner of ten of the planar wars will given more power (this would count as getting stronger and may go towards a UC (which Hong wants because he's lonely))

    The planar war has a function but like I've stated the overgod items don't.

    The only way i can see the overgod items having a function is that Hong uses them as entertainment and watches sovs getting mashed up.

    Or maybe the overgod items are used for change. So that there are new planes being created when a sov dies and a new one wants to practice making a plane for them self. But there is no proof for that

    P.S I'm only trying to think out side of the box. When people tell me "you really can't understand? really?" 

    It makes me fell like it's not a discussion, and you're asking me to think the same way, 

    I think I've given good reasons why the overgod items are flawed and I've dropped the programming of the overgods because the explanation makes sense.

    But like I've said, the overgod items are only hurting the universe and goes against what we know about the overgods. If the overgods protect the laws of the universe and the overgod weapons hurt the universe, don't you think that there is cause for a discussion for it
  • edited November 2015
    Here is a new thought. The planar wars seem to be much harder to win ten consecutive wins, than an overgod mission. So why are the rewards so much less

    Only Fate has won the planar wars and his prize was some more will. But a overgod mission has loads of completed missions, so why is the diffculty and rewards so different
  • The reward from the Planar Wars is greater than a Overgod Mission in my opinion, the amount of Will you obtain from the Planar Wars is explained as having 2 Chief Sovereign Sparks fused. That's riduculous.
  • The reward from the Planar Wars is greater than a Overgod Mission in my opinion, the amount of Will you obtain from the Planar Wars is explained as having 2 Chief Sovereign Sparks fused. That's riduculous.

    The reward gains all Sovereigns of plane! But does this "Will" is fused?!
    As i can see it it is the same as having 2 Chief Sovereign sparks, but NOT FUSED.
    Will+Will <> Will*Will
  • Glen said:

    Which side of Planar War will win in upcoming War?!
    And who will play major role in it?!

    The best way is to hire Paragons for that, but it is really hard to find reasonable payment for them!

    Question: Can Linley find 2 emmisianaries and give them 3 artifact each?!
    He has 3 Sovereign clones, so each clone gives 1 artifact resulting only 2 emmisianaries but with full set of artifacts!
    Is it against rules or not?!
    Because in 1 of spoilers i heard that Sovereign gifted 3 artifact 3 different people but they (2 of them) gave their artifact to third, resulting 1 having 3 artifacts!

    Who wins?!
  • edited November 2015

    The reward from the Planar Wars is greater than a Overgod Mission in my opinion, the amount of Will you obtain from the Planar Wars is explained as having 2 Chief Sovereign Sparks fused. That's riduculous.

    will is pretty powerful. but think about it. all it is, is will. an overgod item makes having more will almost pointless. the chief sov of destruction could kill anyone but the cheif sov of fate with his overgod item extra will or not. the only reason chief sov is so powerful on par with Chief D. is because of self enhancement. so really when you think about it, the difficulty of planar wars and the reward, when compared to overgod missions and their reward is pretty extreme. on one hand you need 10 consective wins (which everyone gangs up to prevent, and happens over 10's of trillions of years), on the other, you have a little quest that all you need to do is collect 3 items. and if you're like linley, you get super lucky and don't even really have to fight for them.



    @tenfap,

    i keep telling you, the universe isn't made to produce a UC. if it was, then becoming a 4 way soul mutate wouldn't be such an extreme task. and there would be road signs here and their saying 'follow this path for ultimate power.'

    the overgods have nothing to do with UC's, they aren't there to help UC's or grow them or find them or create them, they are solely their to keep the CD universe going. it doesn't matter if a UC appears or not.

    you want to know the purpose of overgod items... they serve whatever purpose IET wants.

    the real purpose of the overgod missions seems to be so that those who can pass them can gain greater power. but instead of asking for a power that grows everyone seems to instead has for an immediate boost by way of overgod weapon/item. when instead they could have for more clones, or soul mutations, or lost sovereign sparks (ones lost in chaotic space, or where-ever things go after falling into a tear in chaotic space), affinity to one or all elements/edicts (depends on if they classify each element/edict as a request), ect. as long as it's not beyond the power of the overgods they could give you almost anything.

    when you look at it, this could be hong meng's way of giving the people of the CD universe a chance at growing beyond the limitations of that flawed universe.

    so if you want a more philosophical answer to the purpose of overgod items, the the answer is, you're asking the wrong question, you shouldn't be asking what purpose the overgod items have but what purpose the overgod missions have. and the answer to that is, to grant those who are limited a chance to surpass those limitations, not necessarily, to become a UC but at least to grow beyond the bounds of their universe.

    there tenfap, this is the best answer i can give without having a one on one with IET. it might be completely wrong or it could be completely right, or anywhere in between. i can only go with what i know and how i feel things work. (with IET it's hard to know how things work since he seems to change things on a whim to fit how he wants thing to go.)


    P.S. of course it could be really simple and that the purpose of overgod missions is the same as the planar wars, only aimed at sovereigns. in other words, to kill sovereigns.
  • Vexram said:

    @tenfap,

    you're confused about something. the overgods are not programmed with the purpose of creating or helping a universe creator. the overgods primary purpose is to maintain the CD universe. there are a few side programs they have such as overgod missions, eliminating destructive elements (aka killing sovereigns that destroy material plans), rewarding the victors of 10 straight planar wars, and probably a few other things.

    none of that has anything to do with universe creators. the reason overgod items have nothing to do with UC's is because UC's aren't a factor. they are literally, a one in infinity existence, that is so rare that nobody even prepares for them till they appear.

    Think of Overgods like this.

    They are written applications, with set functions. They may be stronger than all the sovereigns combined but at the end of day, they are no better than Angels who possess no free will.



    The Almighty Froppy
  • The reward from the Planar Wars is greater than a Overgod Mission in my opinion, the amount of Will you obtain from the Planar Wars is explained as having 2 Chief Sovereign Sparks fused. That's riduculous.

    will is pretty powerful. but think about it. all it is, is will. an overgod item makes having more will almost pointless. the chief sov of destruction could kill anyone but the cheif sov of fate with his overgod item extra will or not. the only reason chief sov is so powerful on par with Chief D. is because of self enhancement. so really when you think about it, the difficulty of planar wars and the reward, when compared to overgod missions and their reward is pretty extreme. on one hand you need 10 consective wins (which everyone gangs up to prevent, and happens over 10's of trillions of years), on the other, you have a little quest that all you need to do is collect 3 items. and if you're like linley, you get super lucky and don't even really have to fight for them.



    @tenfap,

    i keep telling you, the universe isn't made to produce a UC. if it was, then becoming a 4 way soul mutate wouldn't be such an extreme task. and there would be road signs here and their saying 'follow this path for ultimate power.'

    the overgods have nothing to do with UC's, they aren't there to help UC's or grow them or find them or create them, they are solely their to keep the CD universe going. it doesn't matter if a UC appears or not.

    you want to know the purpose of overgod items... they serve whatever purpose IET wants.

    the real purpose of the overgod missions seems to be so that those who can pass them can gain greater power. but instead of asking for a power that grows everyone seems to instead has for an immediate boost by way of overgod weapon/item. when instead they could have for more clones, or soul mutations, or lost sovereign sparks (ones lost in chaotic space, or where-ever things go after falling into a tear in chaotic space), affinity to one or all elements/edicts (depends on if they classify each element/edict as a request), ect. as long as it's not beyond the power of the overgods they could give you almost anything.

    when you look at it, this could be hong meng's way of giving the people of the CD universe a chance at growing beyond the limitations of that flawed universe.

    so if you want a more philosophical answer to the purpose of overgod items, the the answer is, you're asking the wrong question, you shouldn't be asking what purpose the overgod items have but what purpose the overgod missions have. and the answer to that is, to grant those who are limited a chance to surpass those limitations, not necessarily, to become a UC but at least to grow beyond the bounds of their universe.

    there tenfap, this is the best answer i can give without having a one on one with IET. it might be completely wrong or it could be completely right, or anywhere in between. i can only go with what i know and how i feel things work. (with IET it's hard to know how things work since he seems to change things on a whim to fit how he wants thing to go.)


    P.S. of course it could be really simple and that the purpose of overgod missions is the same as the planar wars, only aimed at sovereigns. in other words, to kill sovereigns.
    The universe isn't made to find a new UC? but it doesn't mean it hasn't turned that way. In other story's written by IET a book of fate was handed over to the new UC, showing the fate of all living things. This would suggest that there is room for a UC in the CD story

    Hong is lonely and wants to find some company, why not find some one equal to him, like a new UC

    I can understand that the overgods have nothing to do with a new UC but doesn't that mean the overgods shouldn't step in to the world of sovs at all. Only looking after the universe laws is the only thing that is established the overgods do (as well as the overgod missions but it makes little sense). So the overgod items truly have no standing on the universe, if the overgods items don't help the universe, then there is no reason to have them. If the overgod items were made for the potential of the next UC then it might make a little more sense but ultimately the next UC doesn't need them to become the UC. This is why i keep mentioning them. Overgod items don't have a reason to exist. And if they don't have a reason to exist then the overgods are stepping out of their programming. Plus if the overgod missions are there to pass a persons limits, then i ask why. If the universe isn't looking for a new UC then why have something that could pass the limits of sov. Agian it makes little sense   

    You say that the four way mutate wouldn't be such a extreme task but i say that it has to be hard or any powerful person would be able to do it. Plus the book of fate that i mentioned earlier shows the fate of all living things in the universe and the next UC, so to say that the CD universe wasn't made to find/create a new UC is going too far. I never read any thing that said that it wasn't and the evidence I've said above suggest it does  

    In short, the overgod items are flawed. 
    The overgods are programs.
    The CD universe may or may not have been made to find a new UC but that what it is now (because Hong is lonely and the book of fate)

    Finally, to say that the CD universe was built that way because of IET is correct but it also means that what anyone says about CD doesn't matter. If you say it was because the overgod was programmed that way, then "like you said" the only right answer would come from IET and anything we've written is completely wrong (if it doesn't turn up and explain it in CD story then all speculation is wrong, no matter what kind of evidence you use to support it) 
     
  • Overgod items might just be hong meng playing with those lesser beings aka sovereigns.

    They are just what they are; rewards. Otherwise, the universe would be very boring. No competition.

    If there was no reward of will, there would be little to no conflicts of interests.

    The Almighty Froppy
  • Glen said:

    Glen said:

    Which side of Planar War will win in upcoming War?!
    And who will play major role in it?!

    The best way is to hire Paragons for that, but it is really hard to find reasonable payment for them!

    Question: Can Linley find 2 emmisianaries and give them 3 artifact each?!
    He has 3 Sovereign clones, so each clone gives 1 artifact resulting only 2 emmisianaries but with full set of artifacts!
    Is it against rules or not?!
    Because in 1 of spoilers i heard that Sovereign gifted 3 artifact 3 different people but they (2 of them) gave their artifact to third, resulting 1 having 3 artifacts!

    Who wins?!
    ??? :)
  • Lowlav said:

    Overgod items might just be hong meng playing with those lesser beings aka sovereigns.

    They are just what they are; rewards. Otherwise, the universe would be very boring. No competition.

    If there was no reward of will, there would be little to no conflicts of interests.

    you know what, that could make sense.

    The overgods have rules, that they seem to break. It would make sense to say that Hong orders them to do things that go against there programming. This would allow the overgods to do things that they hadn't been programmed to do, without going against their programming   
  • TenFap said:

    Sitrix said:

    Sitrix said:

    TenFap said:


    TenFap said:

    Vexram said:

    @tenfap,

    you're confused about something. the overgods are not programmed with the purpose of creating or helping a universe creator. the overgods primary purpose is to maintain the CD universe. there are a few side programs they have such as overgod missions, eliminating destructive elements (aka killing sovereigns that destroy material plans), rewarding the victors of 10 straight planar wars, and probably a few other things.

    none of that has anything to do with universe creators. the reason overgod items have nothing to do with UC's is because UC's aren't a factor. they are literally, a one in infinity existence, that is so rare that nobody even prepares for them till they appear.

    Then what point does the overgod items have. They don't help the universe, and according to what you wrote the overgods only do things that protects the laws of the universe.

    Overgod items don't protect the universe and with the sov wanting their power and killing each other to gain them, it's clear that the overgod items hurt the universe by making the sov's greedy and kill for them.

    If overgod items don't help the universe or UC then the overgods are doing things out of their program 
    If you think you'll get a logical explanation for everything in CD, then you're wrong. There are may things that IET left out, mostly characters, but he also left out explanations for certain things. For example, why the Overgods specifically issue Overgod missions. And, like Vexram stated, the Overgod missions are similar to the Planar Wars. Both are brought about by the Overgods, and I'm not even going to go into that because Vexram already did.

    It is actually stated in the CD book that the Overgods are program-like existences. The Overgod of Life's appearance was merely a personification of what an Overgod of Life may look like, to which Hong Meng most likely programmed in to it. The Overgods don't actually have an appearance, because they are programs. Only the creator of such programs can create their appearance. 

    I don't know what else to type. There's clear evidence throughout the spoiler forum as well as the several comments me and Vexram have posted. 


    I can understand the programmed state of the overgods and the way they look. Your explanation makes sense and was detailed but what I'm saying is that overgod items are flawed (if not the overgod items, then the overgods them selfs).

    Unlike the planar wars the overgod items are flawed unless your saying that the overgod items main function is that they are there for change.

    It been said that the planar war is there to thin the ranks of the highgods and the winner of ten of the planar wars will given more power (this would count as getting stronger and may go towards a UC (which Hong wants because he's lonely))

    The planar war has a function but like I've stated the overgod items don't.

    The only way i can see the overgod items having a function is that Hong uses them as entertainment and watches sovs getting mashed up.

    Or maybe the overgod items are used for change. So that there are new planes being created when a sov dies and a new one wants to practice making a plane for them self. But there is no proof for that

    P.S I'm only trying to think out side of the box. When people tell me "you really can't understand? really?" 

    It makes me fell like it's not a discussion, and you're asking me to think the same way, 

    I think I've given good reasons why the overgod items are flawed and I've dropped the programming of the overgods because the explanation makes sense.

    But like I've said, the overgod items are only hurting the universe and goes against what we know about the overgods. If the overgods protect the laws of the universe and the overgod weapons hurt the universe, don't you think that there is cause for a discussion for it


    actually there is another way of viewing things.

    cause it is stated that when u complet a overgod mission the reward is that they will grant u a request as long as it is within the boundaries of the laws of the universe.

    most likely the reason why overgod items were made is because the first person that cleared a overgod mission was in pursuit of becoming perfect and that since the start it was possible to make weapons according to the grade of deities that they where and even at the sovereign lvl they probraly assummed that since they overgods were more powerful the way to become a perfect sovereign was to get a set of overgod items, after all when you become a chief sovereign of the laws or edicts then the only way to reach perfection is to become paragon in that law/edict. but the overgod missions change the rules of the game since now if u complet a overgod mission they will grant u a request. may be the reason the reward was a request of the overgods was not to actually make weapons but, to more easily help the predicted next UC to become a UC.


    after all if linley did not have that kind of fuck up moral support in the background that keep shouting to get a overgod weapon the entire time. he will have either ask for his mother or to have the overgod of life kill the four chief sovereigns of the laws that was related to his elements and grant him their sovereign sparks. after all for a deity to kill a sovereign is highly unlikely and for a deity to actually complete a overgod mission is even more unlikely if u are not suppose to have been protected by plot armor. and to have become a UC based on the prediction scroll that Hong Meng have.
  • edited November 2015
    nice point, well made

    You could say that it wasn't the overgods fault that they made a overgod item but rather the person who made the first wish.

    The overgods could of been there to help with the power of the next UC, with an increase of power but the first winner made the mistake of asking for a weapon

    This would allow for the overgods to follow programming that was set by Hong, with out breaking the rules set up by Hong

    After all, the overgods could follow the rules of protecting the rules of the universe and create a overgod weapon, because it followed the rule of granting a single wish set up by Hong (and Hong set up the wish to search and aid the next UC)
  • because we have to note that linley was born god knows how many years after the first mission was complete and also if i dont remember wrong the mission that linley completed was the seventh one. so we cant really say overgods broke the rules by making overgod items, and also the overgods where programs so they could w8 for all of eternity if necesary before the next UC was born and by then god knows how many overgod missions will have passed by, so it is only logical to think that it is either the one who completed the first or second overgod mission that created this kind of complex mess by using a loophole in the system to create overgod items 
  • Mr_Lu said:

    because we have to note that linley was born god knows how many years after the first mission was complete and also if i dont remember wrong the mission that linley completed was the seventh one. so we cant really say overgods broke the rules by making overgod items, and also the overgods where programs so they could w8 for all of eternity if necesary before the next UC was born and by then god knows how many overgod missions will have passed by, so it is only logical to think that it is either the one who completed the first or second overgod mission that created this kind of complex mess by using a loophole in the system to create overgod items 

    TL;DR at bottom.



    Why are Overgod items considered loopholes? Why would they be considered a rule breaker in the first place? Whoever wins the Overgod mission is able to ask for *anything* within the boundary/rules of the universe. Overgod do not break the rules or laws of the universe. They would only be able to do so if they came from outside the universe. Anything created within the universe and created by the laws themselves wouldn't be able to break any rules or go through any loopholes. 

    In my opinion, it would be very logical to think/ask for an Overgod item. Who wouldn't at least give it a try? Besides, every Sov. wants to increase in power. Just think of Orloff, the Chief Sov. of Fate. He does everything he can possibly do to increase his power. He is literally the strongest existence beneath the Overgods in the entire universe because all he does is pursue power.

    To be honest with you, the only thing we can do is speculate. The last book of CD went by so fast that it wasn't even funny. There are so many questions and mysteries still that we can't really give 100% complete answers. Then again, apparently, from the spoilers I've read, there are 3 other universes that was created by Hong with the universe that Linley is in. This was done to balance everything out because otherwise the universe(s) would collapse. This is one of the reasons why Hong says that his universes are flawed. There are three people just like Linley in the other universes, and it just so happens that Linley made it to UC level first/succeeded in becoming a UC. 

    The golden scroll that has every single thing's fate within it shows the fates of *potential* UCs. That means that there are possibly more potential UCs than we think. There isn't just one single individual that is able to become a UC. This is especially known in ST, because Qin Yu's practice, Stellar Transformations, led him to become a UC.

     However, Lin Meng actually told Qin Meng that he was going to help him if he created the incorrect path for the later stages of ST. Lin Meng also stated that Qin Yu could have possibly never have created the correct path unless he was lucky enough to see the death of a star while he sat and meditated on a comet. If that star wasn't there, or it never died, then Qin Yu most likely would have not become a UC without Lin Meng's help. 

    This clearly shows that Qin Yu is a potential candidate for the next UC, but it is also entirely possible that he won't succeed. The golden scroll doesn't show who WILL become a UC, it shows who has the potential to become a UC.

    But, of course, Linley just so happened to have that Soul Stone the Bloodridge(Bloodridge, right?) Sov. gave him when Linley escaped from Reisgem. That Soul Stone is the thing that largely made Linley's soul-mutation successful. Without that Soul Stone, Linley would've definitely died, otherwise IET would have had to use abnormal amounts of plot armor to get Linley through that. 

    Linley could have failed to become a UC just like the other 3 in the other universes. The Overgods and Hong Meng don't control the outcome of a potential UC unless they directly interfere with their fate. The Overgods can't do so anyway because that would break the rules inside their program, if they were even programmed to do so. The Overgods were most likely programmed without a UC in mind, since there are more than one potential UC and the chances of one of the candidates actually succeeding is probably very, very low. A 4-way soul mutation? Without the Soul Stone, even Linley would've failed with the soul mutation unless IET put another 100 layers of plot armor onto him.

    This is a super long thingy majig. Dunno if anyone has actually read this. So, TL;DR

    Golden scroll shows potential UCs, not definite UCs. Therefore, Overgods and Hong Meng himself do not know who will become a UC. The Overgods themselves are most likely not programmed to deal with UCs because they can't deal with something that has power outside of their universe(if that makes sense). They're computer-like programs, anyway. 

    I typed this over 30 minutes and I've lost my train of thought. Hopefully someone understood anything in this giant thing. I didn't intend to make it so big. Oh well.
  • Glen said:

    Which side of Planar War will win in upcoming War?!
    And who will play major role in it?!

    The best way is to hire Paragons for that, but it is really hard to find reasonable payment for them!

    Question: Can Linley find 2 emmisianaries and give them 3 artifact each?!
    He has 3 Sovereign clones, so each clone gives 1 artifact resulting only 2 emmisianaries but with full set of artifacts!
    Is it against rules or not?!
    Because in 1 of spoilers i heard that Sovereign gifted 3 artifact 3 different people but they (2 of them) gave their artifact to third, resulting 1 having 3 artifacts!

    Can anyone at least tell me which side wins?!

  • Glen said:

    Glen said:

    Which side of Planar War will win in upcoming War?!
    And who will play major role in it?!

    The best way is to hire Paragons for that, but it is really hard to find reasonable payment for them!

    Question: Can Linley find 2 emmisianaries and give them 3 artifact each?!
    He has 3 Sovereign clones, so each clone gives 1 artifact resulting only 2 emmisianaries but with full set of artifacts!
    Is it against rules or not?!
    Because in 1 of spoilers i heard that Sovereign gifted 3 artifact 3 different people but they (2 of them) gave their artifact to third, resulting 1 having 3 artifacts!

    Can anyone at least tell me which side wins?!
    it's a tie. or so i was told.
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